Re: Starwars and Amplifone Issue

From: PJ <pj1_at_shaw.ca>
Date: Wed Mar 24 2010 - 04:24:23 EDT

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: teeray
  To: vectorlist@vectorlist.org
  Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:37 PM
  Subject: Re: VECTOR: Starwars and Amplifone Issue

    -----Original Message-----
    From: John Robertson
    Sent: Mar 24, 2010 1:25 AM
    To: vectorlist@vectorlist.org
    Subject: Re: VECTOR: Starwars and Amplifone Issue

    PJ wrote:

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: teeray
        To: vectorlist@vectorlist.org
        Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 6:37 PM
        Subject: Re: VECTOR: Starwars and Amplifone Issue

          -----Original Message-----
          From: pj pj
          Sent: Mar 23, 2010 9:53 PM
          To: vectorlist@vectorlist.org
          Subject: Re: VECTOR: Starwars and Amplifone Issue

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: teeray <teeray@earthlink.net>
          Date: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 6:06 pm
          Subject: Re: VECTOR: Starwars and Amplifone Issue
          To: vectorlist@vectorlist.org

>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: John Robertson <pinball@telus.net>
> >Sent: Mar 22, 2010 10:56 PM
> >To: vectorlist@vectorlist.org
> >Subject: Re: VECTOR: Starwars and Amplifone Issue
> >
> >pj pj wrote:
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "andre.huijts@upcmail.nl" <andre.huijts@upcmail.nl>
> >> Date: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:03 am
> >> Subject: RE: VECTOR: Starwars and Amplifone Issue
> >> To: vectorlist@vectorlist.org
> >>
> >> > "Super bright objects like a shield level change, the closest
> >> > green attract
> >> > mode
> >> > text or fireballs are so bright that the vectors grow out
> of focus"
> >> >
> >> > Isn't that the way it's supposed to be (except for the attract
> >> > mode). I
> >> > think I
> >> > read that on Jed Margolin's site that this was done on
> purpose (like
> >> > defocussing
> >> > the concentric rings on the Death Star explosion).
> >> >
> >> > The fireballs on my 25" Amplifone get out of focus when
> nearing too.
> >> >
> >> I read that as well, but after looking at youtube videos of a
> number
> >> of games shot off screen, mine is seriously much brighter to
> the point
> >> where if I don't cut the screen control down, its to the
> point where
> >> it's near blinding and unable to provide diming as the shot
> >> diminishes. On one of your videos, the shield loss
> makes the vectors
> >> drawing the gage brighter, on mine it lights up to the point
> where the
> >> vectors are so bright they distort as the video amps are
> going into
> >> clip and not just pusing the beam current to defocus. I
> could live
> >> with it if it were like yours. I'm going to look into whether
> cutting
> >> the B+ or changing the biasing of the video amps to match the
> values
> >> from the WG will make a difference. I tested the CRT
> before I bought
> >> the game, since having a med res tube on the amplifone was a
> deal
> >> breaker for me.
> >>
> >> On the last game John Robertson had, he was running a WG, and
> the
> >> fireballs looked "normal", even by WG standards.
> Other Amps I've
> >> seen are not like this one -they put the WG to shame (ducking
> from WG
> >> owners throwing things at me). My WG in an early
> production Tempest
> >> is much sharper at this point.
> >Ah, but that was my super-reliable raster conversions - it uses
> an early
> >colour Wells Gardner raster HV section not the wimpy Atari
> one...I
> >suspect the original Ampliphone just couldn't keep up with the
> demand!>
> >
> >
> >John :-#)#
> >
> >--
> >John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
> >Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, VideoGames)
> > www.flippers.com
> >"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
> >
> >----------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------
> >>
> >>
> >>From: pj pj
> >>
> >>Sent: Mar 23, 2010 7:07 PM
> >>
> >>To: vectorlist@vectorlist.org
> >>
> >>Subject: Re: VECTOR: Starwars and Amplifone Issue
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Here's a link to some pictures of what is happening with the
> game. Hope pic:=words*1000
> >>http://geepeeg.spaces.live.com/?lc=4105
> >>
> >>
>
> In this order, on the deflection board
> Check CR14, CR15, CR16, CR17 and C17, C18
> Make sure C17 and C18 are installed correctly and correct size.
> Still no go
> Check CR2, CR11
> Still no go
> Check CR3, CR4, CR12, and CR13
>
> Tim
>
          Thanks Tim.

          I've changed everything on the list except CR14-17 already to no avail. I figured that the power rectifiers would be ok, since I've only have about 0.4V AC ripple on the lines going to the HV board, and the distortion is static, there is no moving jitter and the crosshatches as well as the brightness test screen are perfect.

          Is it sensitive to the types of diode other than current and voltage rating, or will most any 100V 6A diode work? The data sheet for the MR751 states standard recovery.

          C17+18 are 4700/50. I had a hell of a time finding these. I condemned the original ones since there was over 1.5V ripple on the DC rails. There still was no dancing vectors though even at that point.

          Simon suggested the ceramic caps on the AVG near the DACS and I'm presuming the ceramic caps C4 and C14.

          What effect, if any would the bigblue have on the picture were it failing? I did notice that the 10.x unregulated volts on the game board is at ~13v.

          --------------------------------------------------------------------

          Any 100V 6A diode should work.
          Did you say you had the board connected to an XY scope and everything looked OK, even the text?
          If so, then I would think the problem would be in the monitor.
          Is the 0.4 volt AC ripple on both the positive and negitive?
          Is this a 19" or 25"? If 25" does it have the correct yoke?

          Tim

      Yes, I ran the board on a scope and everything looks A-OK, even the text. The ripple is on both from the ground to each line. On a scope, its the usual filter ramp ripple like a sawtooth.

      The tube is a 19" W00X, with the correct yoke, the original mounting cement was still in place, with associated dust. I pulled the yoke and cleaned it thinking that the dust might be conductive enough to cause problems.

    Clutching at straws here, PJ. Pulling the yoke is more likely to cause misalignment of colour...

    Your Big Blue is good if you have 13VDC, in most cases they run closer to 10VDC after all these years.

    Your ripple may or may not be important - what is the voltage of the ripple? 0.5VAC? 0.05, 0.005...is the scope on the same outlet as the game? You can get misleading ground loops...

    John :-#)#

    -------------------------------------------------

    I was thinking the same thing. Did you go through all of the realignment procedure? It's a real pain.

    You could try temporarily running it without the add on 50 ohm resistors on the HV board.

    I don't use them, I use regulators rated for 2 amps. Those resistors just hide problems with the regulators

    and burn the board.

    Tim

I replaced the board mounted ones with Dale aluminium 25W resistors that are bolted to the heatsink that eliminate the board cooking heat. I was twisted when I saw how they bridged the regulators.

I was going to build a regulator board using LM338 5A positive and 79HG 5A negative adjustable regulators, which should be enough to run the HV and deflection board, Like an LV2000 on steroids.

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Received on Wed Mar 24 03:24:34 2010

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