Re: Tempest twisting images...

This WG monitor does not have the input protection PCB or on-board
input protection. Early one...

As I understand it the H1 prom added the Copyright ATARI bit to try
and prevent this collapse. The H1 I have does have the correct CS
according to various references on this issue. Makes no difference.
Oddly enough the original H1 (.116 I think) has the same image on the
screen.

I am going to try strapping the board for the 2532s (version 3
software) that I have and see if that does anything to improve the
situation. If it fixes it I might simply dump all the Program data
onto a single 27256 (keeping the original Vector PROMS) and wire that
in so I don't waste a pile of 16s or 32s, plus greatly reduce the
risk of PROM socket issues.

John :-#)#

At 7:09 PM -0600 7/26/07, Jess Askey wrote:
>Does it have the little satellite board that sits parallel with the
>main PCB? If so, that may be causing the collapse as it is sort of a
>clampdown circuit. Make your screen smaller and see if the collapse
>stops. If so, you might want to take off the protection PCB.
>
>John Robertson wrote:
>
>>Re: VECTOR: Tempest twisting images...
>>Additional info.
>>
>>This has a LV2000 voltage regulator kit installed, and this is a
>>monitor effect as the problem does not show up when using a scope
>>set on XY with the monitor disconnected. the monitor works just
>>fine on the XY convergence generator by the way, and all images are
>>good except for the unbalanced ones (more image on the top than the
>>bottom) for TEMPEST name and between player screens. All the tubes,
>>etc. work fine, the game is totally playable - it is an irritating
>>video artifact.
>>
>>John :-#)#
>>
>>At 1:16 PM -0700 7/26/07, John Robertson wrote:
>>
>>>OK, now have another Tempest c/t in the shop, with the same
>>>!@#$!@#$ twisting of the image between players and when the
>>>"TEMPEST" name comes up. I HAVE installed the H1 Eprom (.318)
>>>version that displays the copyright info, but the picture still
>>>twists the left side of the word "TEMPEST" once it is full size
>>>and in white.
>>>
>>>
>>>Heck, the game works fine, and I do not have enough hours to
>>>troubleshoot something the customer is not complaining about.
>>>
>>>
>>>Oh, the machine does have the rev 2 ROMs (2716s) installed and the
>>>checksums match the notes on this problem. The monitor does not
>>>have the input protection board either.
>>>
>>>
>>>John :-#(#
>>>
>>>
>>>At 12:25 PM -0700 6/14/06, John Robertson wrote:
>>>
>>>>Thanks Jeff, that helps! Version 3 is just one ROM image change,
>>>>isn't it? I currently have RV2 and Tubes installed...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>John :-#)#
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>At 12:43 PM -0600 6/14/06, Jeff Hendrix wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Version 3 of the ROMs fixes this problem.
>>>>>What happens is the input protection board only see deflection
>>>>>in one direction and shuts down the inputs.
>>>>>Version 3 puts a copyright at the bottom of the screen and keeps
>>>>>the picture balanced, preventing the collapse.
>>>>>
>>>>>On 6/14/06, John Robertson
>>>>><<mailto:pinball@telus.net>pinball@telus.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Found the problem. Turns out the replacement XY driver board I
>>>>>had left (from my parts stock) is a version P327 with the input
>>>>>protection circuit. I found that this circuit was the cause of
>>>>>the twisting by hooking my scope to the inputs of Q600 and Q700
>>>>>and getting the same twisting, but not at the X & Y outputs on
>>>>>the motherboard. Hence something was a problem in this circuit.
>>>>>Replaced the two transistors Q804 & Q805, plus two of the diodes
>>>>>D806 & D808 (Germanium I think) with 1N914s.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Same problem. Poked around for another 1/2 hour...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Gave up and clipped R810 & R811 - inputs to the protection
>>>>>circuit - and now the picture is fine.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>As Tempest originally worked without the protection circuit I am
>>>>>going to leave it disabled here - I suspect this circuit simply
>>>>>can't handle the patterns that Tempest throws up, or the
>>>>>capacitors are too low (88ufd instead of 100ufd, within spec
>>>>>+10/-20% for caps.). Still it looks great and I have to move
>>>>>on...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I made a MPEG of the twisting image, if anyone wants a copy let me know.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>John :-#)#
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>At 2:13 PM -0700 6/12/06, John Robertson wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>Yes, I tried tightening the pins on the sockets. Now that I
>>>>>>think of it the plug feels a little un-tight. I'll check stock
>>>>>>to see if I have a plug assembly with better bite. I did do the
>>>>>>exchange power transistor plug with the X transistors - the Y
>>>>>>group won't reach - to make sure the problem wasn't on those
>>>>>>two. Forgot to fully test the Y plug!
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Will come back with part two tomorrow when I get back to the
>>>>>shop - currently I'm in the warehouse digging around:
>>>>><http://flippers.com/TimeTravelWarehouse.htm>http://flippers.com/TimeTravelWarehouse.htm
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>There are a number of vector games there folks, good time to get
>>>>>good deals...bulk buys encouraged!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>John :-#)#
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>At 9:58 PM +0100 6/12/06, simon wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>John
>>>>>>
>>>>>I had some strange image problems with bad Deflection transistor
>>>>>sockets, check they are good.
>>>>>
>>>>>Cheers
>>>>>
>>>>>Simon
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>>
>>>>>From: <mailto:pinball@telus.net>John Robertson
>>>>>
>>>>>To: <mailto:vectorlist@vectorlist.org>vectorlist@vectorlist.org
>>>>>
>>>>>Sent: Monday, June 12, 2006 8:39 PM
>>>>>
>>>>>Subject: VECTOR: Tempest twisting images...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Ok, I'm lazy enough, but has anyone seen a situation with a
>>>>>Tempest monitor where the picture twists (+ Y axis) upon the
>>>>>display of the TEMPEST name for a second? Rather interesting
>>>>>distortion, I originally thought it was Q606 (2N3716) that was
>>>>>having life issues, but no, replacing it didn't change this
>>>>>distortion, then I tried the driver - MPUSU57 - again not the
>>>>>problem.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Understand that I've re-capped the HV (stable voltages) and
>>>>>installed the LV2000 kit - stable +/- B voltages. Grounds are
>>>>>excellent, tried jumper wires to double check. Game seems happy
>>>>>otherwise, no smoke...connectors all inspected and solder built
>>>>>up on the monitor driver board pins as usual.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>There is also a twisting wave that appears in the picture on
>>>>>various levels - only during play, not in the attract mode -
>>>>>curiouser and curiouser.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I thought it had to do with the speakers as it seemed to be most
>>>>>prominent when the sounds were very active (lots of shots,
>>>>>explosions), so I unplugged the speakers - no change.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Yeah, pictures will be nice, but I'm off the warehouse right now
>>>>>to deal with other issues. Perhaps I can get them tomorrow and
>>>>>post them somewhere.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Archives have nothing under twist or distortion that I can find
>>>>>relating to this...closest I found was "Tempest Boardset
>>>>>Barreling" by Dave Langley back a few years.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>John :-#(#
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>
>>>>>John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
>>>>>Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, VideoGames)
>>>>> <http://www.flippers.com>www.flippers.com
>>>>>"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.3/361 - Release Date: 11/06/2006
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>
>>>>>John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
>>>>>Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, VideoGames)
>>>>> <http://www.flippers.com>www.flippers.com
>>>>>
>>>>>"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>
>>>>>John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
>>>>>Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, VideoGames)
>>>>> <http://www.flippers.com>www.flippers.com
>>>>>"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>
>>>>John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
>>>>Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, VideoGames)
>>>> <http://www.flippers.com>www.flippers.com
>>>>"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"

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Received on Thu Jul 26 21:35:28 2007